T2- B/W Sanguine Throne

[Nirosen]

I made this deck with this thought in mind, " I wanted to make the deck in such a way that my opponent has very few cards in his graveyard (i.e bloodghast and crypt answers). I also wanted to use Sanguine bond in an efficient way, not just trying to combo." The first cards chosen where the essential lifegain creatures. Baneslayer Angel, Child of Night, and Vampire Nighthawk. Baneslayer and Nighthawk are great cards in general and since we are making a sanguine based deck they fit nicely, Child rounds out the curve a bit. As I continued I knew I wanted removal however spicifically removal that exiles creatures. At this point in constructed we have journey to nowhere, oblivion ring, and Path to exile, I also consider Pacifism a sort of exile. Looking at these cards i realized that the majority of my deck would be made of enchantments. I dont know if you remember but there was an interesting enchantment from conflux. Sigl of the Empty Throne, and this led to the following. PS. I will link the deck once zendicar is available for deck building on mtgvault.

Creatures = 12
4 x Baneslayer Angel
4 x Vampire Nighthawk
4 x Child of Night

Enchantments = 24
4 x Sanguine Bond
4 x Sigil of the Empty Trone
4 x Oblivion Ring
4 x Journey to Nowhere
4 x Pacifism
4 x Sunspring Expedition

Instants = 4
2 x Path to Exile
2 x Disfigure

Lands = 20
4 x Marsh Flats
4 x Kabira Crossroads
6 x Plains
6 x Swamps

Now before you go crazy thinking that the mana cant possibly work or that there is a serious scarcity of creatures let me give you some idea of how the deck plays.

This deck has a total of 16 "answers" 10 exile target creature, 2 -2/-2(disfigure) and pacifism which is like and exile. However in the early game you are usually puting down a sunspring expedition turn 1 with a child of night and a nighthawk by turn 3. If not you have Pacified and O ringed their first few creatures. Buy turn 4 u have either drawn ur sanguine bond or your sigil, if niether u either have more "answers" or a baneslayer. Now comes turn five. You most likely have taken a decent amount of damage buy this turn because you held onto your journeys and pacifisms till now. In comes the Sigil and turn six you are making 4/4 angels for 2 mana, i.e the journies and pacifisms, while also "taking one of their creatures of the board. Some of you may now ask why not just put in Luminarch, and the answer is because luminarch is 4/4 angels for 2 mana if i stop damage for 4 turns. i consider the angels from my sigil a 4/4 flying 2 drop that has exile target creature when this card enters play tatooed on its neck. I still have to test this deck some more but it has been doing very well so far. oh and lets not forget the baneslayer, sunpsring expedition, sanguine bond. if baneslayer gets thru and hits your looking at doing 18 dmg by poping sunspring.

Please comment and give your thoughts, opinions, and advice.

The Curve
1cc 8
2cc 12
3cc 8
4cc 0
5cc 12

[endrance227]

hmm.. have you thought of adding landbind ritual or narrow escapes

this is just a suggestion though i like the deck .:):):):)

[Nirosen]

Actually i had looked at both those cards however i think the narrow escape is just not needed and there are better cards that take up that slot atm. The landbind ritual is nice but most of the time this deck is playing on 6 or seven mana, with 3 to 4 plains in play. The thing i like about this deck is i dont have to actually play the deck in a way. The win conditions just happen just for playing the cards. Like my removal is great and i can beat in with nighthawks, but when i put down a sigil my removal becom angels as well. Or my lifegain is good to midigate red burn but when i play Sanguine it becomes a win condition. I tride to desine the deck with the same mantra that landfall has. it rewards you for just playing the game. Atm the deck is undefeated but am trying to get a sidboard going which looks sad atm because its entirely devoted to Mill protection.

4 x Silence
4 x Quest for Ancient Secrets
4 x Drowned Catacomb
3 x who knows

Ty for the thoughts : )

[endrance227]

for mill control you could add discard cards
mind shatter:D
mind rot
or a vess as well :eek::eek::eek::eek:

[Nirosen]

I actually made a creaturless M10 Deck that milled you and Destroyed your hand and then blew up vess to bring back all your creatures to kill you. The only issue is against other creaturless decks but then you just side board 15 good creatures lol.

Here it is, PS. it def isn't as fun or competative as my Sanguine Throne.

Vess Goes Boom!!! (http://www.mtgvault.com/ViewDeck.aspx?DeckID=26783)

[NickFlamel]

The main reson the I don't like this deck is (No offence) It isn't playable. It intireally creature hate and in the current meta game the creatures are small, fast, and pumpable. this means that there is no way in hell you can answer all of their threats. Also against burn and control your screwed. Also the removal is sorta weak, it all costs 2 or 3.
"i consider the angels from my sigil a 4/4 flying 2 drop that has exile target creature when this card enters play tatooed on its neck." Now, the angels aren't even 2 drop, you play the Throne on turn 5 and then on turn 6 you get one or two.
I'm sorry, but its just two slow.

[Nirosen]

Disclaimer: everything i am saying is experience through actually play testing this deck against the decks that are apearing in the current meta game. Also you can never make a true conclusion wether a deck is playable or not without actually playtesting it.

Yes in this format the creatures are fast, the fact that they are pumpable doesnt matter when getting exiled and yes the deck has a harder time against burn and some control. I never said it was the ultimate deck. However it isn't "just to slow". Atm my deck doesnt have to wait till turn 5 to get going, however by turn 5 i already have the opponent tapping out trying to get threats on the bored. Yes there is a ton of creature hate because most of the decks in the format are heavy creatures. Currently i am testing a sideboard to help against control and Burn. Also yes i payed 5 to play the sigil but i may have spent 5 mana to protect myself and activate luminarch.(which is why i picked sigil over luminarch). One comment i dont understand however is that you said the removal is sorta weak because it cost 2 or 3 mana.... That doesnt make sense. journey to nowhere and path are some of the only answers to bloodghast. Also having a card that exiles for 1,2,or 3 mana is cheap so if i have an answer to their 3-6 mana creature with 2 mana i dont see how that is weak. Also my total number of answers is 16, not including nighthawk(deathtouch) which would be 20 and if you add in baneslayer(5/5 vigilence firststrike lifelink pro dragons and demon) that makes 24. Most decks in the format have about 22 creatures. Also not to mention the angels but i dont count them. (if the deck was stacked it could generate 90+ angels, never happens just a fun piece of info)

This deck is great against the following atm.
Again this is actual playtesting
Cobra ramp - usually going for a bainfire to the face but never can do it for enough dmg. Or quick overrun but there are no creatures to overrun with.

Some itterations of mill/ draw-dmg.

Vampires. - with answers to every card they have except for the pro white one they are tapping out trying to put threats on the board

Ally Aggro - Since i am removing creatures from the game faster then they come out their allies stay small, also they have to waist mana re-equiping.

Plainswalker control - Oblivion rings plus Sanguine dmg that can be redirected to plainwalkers are good answers. Its hard to overun with garruk if your creatures are all exiled.

Now the weaknesses

Jund aggro - The sideboard is mostly dedicated to getting in spells like harms way, Safe passage, Silence and the like to deal with it. Currently the games have gone 50:50

Red Deck Wins - Again i am trying to develope the side board to help with this until turn 4 when I have gained some life and have springs waiting to pop.



I hope you dont think i am mindlessly trying to protect the validaty of my deck, I'm not. I am however trying to give you information from a good few hours of playtesting agaisnt some fo the main archetypes of the new infant format.

Thank you for pointing out the aggro problem, however again i always refrain from saying a deck just wont work for 2 reasons. 1) You truly do not know the decks capabilities until you play test it, there may be card interactions that you didnt think of during your "theory crafting." 2) Even if your able to simulate a game in your head it can never replace the value and experience gained from actual playtesting.

Again Thanks for your input and no offence taken :)

[NickFlamel]

What I'm trying to say is that unless you have cheap (1 mana) removal (Burn/Lightning Bolt) you can only kill one creature a turn which puts you behind and you will rarely be able to catch up.
Now these are some things that I forgot to say/or just thought up: The main decks are going to be g/w aggro (With splash) and red deck wins. Now, you can't keep up with the red deck and the white deck will have answers to some of your answers, what I would do is splash either red or blue, blue counter spells to be iretaiting in general and red for quick creature kill. The blue will help against control and red deck wins (Flash Freeze is great) and red will help against control (Lightning bolt when they tap out) also red has volcanic fallout against red-deck-wins.


My current deck is g/r/u, It plays mana fixing green creatures and blue conterspells and red removal. It will lose first game to aggro, but then sideboards out for more burn. it uses scythe tiger to stop people from killer it, and counter spells against wrath effects. Its very fast and can't run out of mana.

I don't mean to offend by any of this, I will be posting my deck soon, any comments would be appreciated.

[Nirosen]

Stop saying you dont mean to offend me, I am an adult and do not take offence to constructive criticism. The reason i posted my deck is to have people post their thoughts so I can further test my deck.

To some things you posted,

I have 1 mana responses, 4 pre sideboard and its looking like 8 post made up of path to exile and disfigures (disfigure is a huge thorne in red deck wins back)

To the counterspell splash, That would go against what the deck is trying to do. I want creatures on the field. adding counterspells would give me dead cards in my hand. Also again the paths and disfigures are for the instant speed removal. By actually killing their creatures with burn goes against what the deck is trying to do.

Now these are the actual main archetypes atm

Cascade Control - R/G/W,u
Jund Aggro - R/G/B
Banslayer Control - W/U/R
Naya Ally Agro - W/R/G
Naya ally contol - W/R/G
Red Deck Wins - R
Vampires - Usually mono black but there are a ton of iterations atm.

ATM the sideboard looks like this

4 Silence
2 Path to exile
2 Disfigure
4 Harm's way
3 Brave the Elements

Anyway im doing better against the agro redish decks once i sideboard the paths, disfigures, harm's and silences. The brave elements is a judgment protection. My win ratio now against red deck wins is 60:40 sometimes 70:30 with good hands. I will post a few match reviews once i get the sideboard set.

[Nirosen]

These are just some cards that i've been looking at for an addition to either the sideboard or deck, nothing really special, i prob will play test em anyway to see how they interact.

Mark of Asylum
Honor of the Pure
Angelsong
Soul's Grace
Zealous Persecution
Mesa Enchantress
Safe Passage
Tainted Sigil
Ajani Goldmane
Open the Vaults

[NickFlamel]

Srry about the don't mean to offend thing but someone blew a gasket on me for something I said once. Anyhow, Mesa Enchantmress is a beast and I would put that in.

[Seras]

i would swap out two of the Sigils for two Mark of Asylum

adding two Greater Auramancy would be a great idea since you're putting a lot of your game into enchantments.

maybe throw in 2-3 Mourning Thrulls? they are a black/white deck's best friend :)

[ebichuhamster]

whoa whoa wait.... does protection from white protect my creatures from a judgement day?!

[Seras]

no, Protection does not affect cards like Day of Judgment or Wrath of God.

Protection prevents the creature from being targeted(amongst other things), cards like Day of Judgment do not target specific creatures.

[ebichuhamster]

not trying to get out of subject here, but I that's what I imagined. Nirosen said at some point
"The Brave the elements is there for protection against judgement[...]"
I thought he was referring to Judgment day...


Anyway.
First, you mentioned that you have 24 creatures but I only see 12. Obviously not including the angel's created via the sigil. Maybe I'm missing something here.

If for some reason you made some mistake and you do have only 12 creatures (not the only way of winning since you have sanguine bond) you should consider adding soul stair expedition. Its a 1 drop enchantment not too far from the deck's mission. If you can't protect your creatures from a nasty terminate, you can bring at most 2 back after turn 3!

Also, open the vaults should be at least once in the main deck. I don't know about anyone else but I'll be playing Tempest of Light in all my W decks, regardless of my own enchantments. There are too many cheap and nasty ascensions out there that do too much harm.

I should also mention rethinking your decision about Narrow Escape. Just by adding 2 or 3 you can assure your Baneslayer OR sanguine bond some peace of mind against anything. And heck it even gives you 4 life!

About the cards you were thinking about adding:

Mark of Asylum's a very decent 2 drop, not only for the sideboard.
Honor of the Pure would be only pumping up the Baneslayer so that's not too efecient for this.
Angelsong good cheap cyclable holy day....maybe
Soul's Grace would target your own mostly because you're already taking big creatures out with O ring and Journey. maybe a sideboard.
Zealous Persecution- GREAT 2 drop for those pesky goblins and soldiers sideboard.
Mesa Enchantress... a 2/2 creature that will probably give you 1 extra card each turn...hmm I'll pass.
Safe Passage... consider Angelsong before this one I'd say...
Tainted Sigil well...the only reason i can think -not- to put it is because it's not an enchantment.
Ajani Goldmane always a hard decision. Although I'd consider Elspeth before him because her last ability serves more the purpose of assuring those sanguine bond and baneslayers be kept alive.


I really like this deck. Maybe that's why I've put in a little more thinking into this.

Good luck!